Skip to main content
Close

Wildlife Spotting

Photo by Namitha
Published on Project Noah
Zoom
NominateNominate for Wildlife Photograph of the Month
reportFlag Spotting

10.7682, 78.813

Field Notes

Description:

It is the imprint of a leaf [fossil] from Trichi, Tamilnadu, India. Could somebody help me identify this leaf.

Species ID Suggestions

Comments (37)

Hi Emma, Where are they doing this research. It sounds really cool.
It could be a good decision. We have Dr Bagchi and his wife Dr Manashi Bagchi doing a lot of research in this area and coming up with quite good products like Reservertol,grape seed extract, etc.
Hi Emma, You are a very lovely person and I am happy that I could meet you through PN. It is practically impossible to judge anyone by what one say [ "one write"]. Because we don't know the background from which we come from and our personal interests. I have never done cycad leaflet dissection, I probably will get to do it in my final year. I am also happy to hear that you also love Botany. I actually took botany because of my love and passion for botany. Here in India we have a pattern that most students who graduate from school goes to attend professional courses like Medicine and Engineering. I was the only student who took botany [ a traditional course] in my class. I am telling this just that you could know me better. It is lovely to have you help me.
Namitha, i personally love Botany. i shared it just because of the play of words and also was a bit surprised that somebody would write a poem on Botany!! My favorite was the dissection of the cycas leaflet and viewing it under the microscope. Thanks for asking and not assuming. This is one thing that I learned on Project ,is not to assume and not to disregard. Now adays Botany has developed a great respect in medicine and Bio-Pharmaceuticals.
Hi Emma, I don't know what made you quote the poem Botany by Berton Braley. I have read it once and I thought it had a good rhyme scheme but I did not take it very seriously, because it was basically the play on some words and not really "Botany" as its name suggests [It is my personal opinion because I don't think that is botany]. I am not sure what you really meant by quoting that poem, so could you please tell me why you said so.
Namitha, As a poet has said of learning botany, “It helps to train and spur the brain, unless you haven’t gotany"
In the link that Mark Ridway has provided the cycad have leaflets. In Emmas link they are telling about a whole leaf with a specific venation pattern and no leaflets. In this spotting, at a glance leaflets can't be found because of the marking between individual veins but does anyone think that there are leaflets in this spotter when looked closer.
I did not see any other fossils in PN, that is why I was doubtful as to where to place it. I know that it is a plant fossil but I thought only live and present day specimens could be included under plants. I will move it to the plants category thank you for that suggestion Mark Ridgway. And about what you said about the origin of jackfruit trees. Jackfruit trees are not found solely in South Asia. Jackfruit trees are found in Africa too. Though it has nothing to do with our findings at this stage but I was just making a point. Since jackfruit trees are found in Africa they might have parallely evolved. But at this pointing I think it is some species very close to Komlopteris cenozoicus as Emma said.
Yeah I am a botany student Emma.
Wow. Emma that is a pretty cool lead. There are some examples of imprint fossils which have very similar venation to that of this spotter [open venation, I guess] in the link you have provided. This Komlopteris cenozoicus sp. seems very similar http://www.amjbot.org/content/95/4/465/F2.expansion.html
Here's a good comparison... http://www.oum.ox.ac.uk/thezone/fossils/history/jurass04.htm
Yes good point Mark. In the Cretaceous Period, India was a floating island near the eastern coast of Africa. It wasn't joined to southern Asia yet.
Wow Emma. With digging skills like those maybe you should have been a palaeontologist. Very interesting stuff isn't it. The 'big' history of life on earth really fascinates me. When one gets a grip on the scale of things human history is put well into perspective. Well done. This spotting should probably go under plants.
Basically what they are saying is that they found a particular species of a seed fern who's lineage survived thru the Cretaceous period. This study holds good in Tasmania and Tamil Nadu. It also stresses that it is very confusing to distinguish between Seed Ferns and Cycadaleans due to the similarities. it further goes to give tips on how to differentiate between the two. Are you a student of Botany?
Namitha in the link provde which belongs to American journal of Botany, I found this following info.............. New fossils from Tasmania show that one seed-fern lineage survived into the ..... and associated plant fossils from Tiruchirapalli District, Tamil Nadu. .... Development of floras in the middle part of the Cretaceous period, and older angiosperms.Leaves pinnate (all specimens incomplete). Pinnules subopposite, narrowly ovate to lanceolate (Figs. 1–4), 18–82 mm long, 8–24 mm wide; margins entire to slightly lobed (Figs. 5–8); apex acute but rounded (Figs. 1, 2); base acute, asymmetrical with the acroscopic margin more sharply angled and, at least in distal pinnules, slightly decurrent (Figs. 3, 4). Midvein distinct proximally but evanescent in the distal half of each pinnule (Figs. 2, 4, 8). http://www.amjbot.org/content/95/4/465.full arris (1964) discussed the difficulties in consistently distinguishing cycadaleans and seed ferns based on fragmentary macrofossils and dispersed cuticle. However, he noted a tendency for seed ferns to have pinnules with decurrent margins and veins that were divergent and twice or more pinnately divided. Among known cycads, Bowenia alone is reminiscent of seed ferns in having bipinnate, superficially fern-like foliage with divergent veins. Coincidentally, well-preserved Bowenia foliage occurs with Komlopteris in the Tasmanian fossil assemblage. However, it is immediately distinguishable from K. cenozoicus by its possession of toothed leaf margins and a range of very distinct cuticular features, many of them shared with other cycads.
Thank you Mark Ridgway I will try comparing it with cycads.
Ahh.. now we're getting some perspective. I would not even think about trying to link to mangos, jackfruit etc. as they are regarded as originating in south Asia. 'India' did not get there until 38 million years ago - way too late for this fossil. I would look at cycad types.
Yeah you are right about the location of India at that period and that angiosperms started appearing only towards the end of the Cretaceous period. So I was trying to find the similarity of this fossil with present day plant and maybe go back to there ancestors which might lead us to an answer. If the theories of evolution are right there must surely have been an ancestor of the present day trees in the prehistoric age. And also as you said earlier it can be that of a fern like ptyllophyllum, but the absence of leaflet is what is confussing me.
flowering plants started appearing in the Cretaceous period - but somehow I don't think they were mango, jackfruit or banyan !! - we are talking 135 million years ago and India was not the subcontinent as we know it now...it's good you seem to have a time period for this fossil.
Thank you chief red earth
Chief Red Earth to the rescue!!
Emma, its like 145-65 million years ago.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretaceous Is it the 1800's?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trees_of_India. I was browsing thru this link. Jackfruit does seem a possibility.
Hi Emma, I found this fossil from a region which used to experience alternate spells of Transgression and regression of sea.
Its a Cretaceous period imprint fossil. In Trichi there are long belts of Cretaceous period fossils.
Thanks Namitha!! ,now I remember very well, We use to make garlands for the doorways with these!!
Hi Emma, you can find the mango leaf herehttps://www.google.co.in/search?hl=en&biw=930&bih=431&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=mango+leaves&btnG= There is one mango tree infront of my house but I don't have a photo of it now. I will take a picture and upload it soon.
This fossil could be hundreds of millions of years old. Expecting to match it to modern plant ID's is a bit naive. Does anyone at least know what epoch it belongs to?
I have eaten mangoes off mango trees ,so I should remember! It was a while ago. Depending on the location where the fossil was found you might be able to come to a conclusion.
Thank you Leuba, but there are no leaflets in this fossil. So I don't think its a fern. I also wish I get the right ID soon.
It can't be a mango tree leaf Emma because the shapes are very different , I can understand how you associated the two trees together. since you have not seen both trees it will be difficult for you. Mango leaf is narrower and a bit more longer.
I have not seen a jack fruit tree,so you could be right. How about Mango?Where did you find this fossil? Near a water front?
Thanks Emma that is a good lead, I did not think of Banyan tree. It could also be jackfruit tree leaf. By the size of it.
May be a fern frond with equal length pinnules ( little "leaflets")and a very thick midrib. What a great find ! hope you get an ID for it - would love to know...
not Neem or ,Pipal, Could be Banyan.
Photographed
PublishedAugust 24, 2012

Accelerate our Mission to Photograph 
Every Species in the World!

Image
Butterflies icon

Wildlife Community

Wildlife Community

Join a worldwide community passionate about wildlife and nature!

Join Project Noah

Nature School

Nature School

Transform your green space into a curiosity-creating nature classroom!

Visit Nature School

Wildlife Game

Wildlife Game

Defend wildlife throughout the jungle in thrilling nature game!

Play Baboon